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Resto druid, haste cap, dropping CF, what to get?
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562925
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340332
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Post by
sunwukung
Keep the SP/haste gems, imo. Unless you are running hardmodes (even then I still question), the difference between 831 and 856 is statistically insignificant.
I am at 837 haste with no CF. With 2of the 3 raidwide haste bonuses in 25man, I reach a 1 sec nourish cast which equals a 1sec GCD.
Post by
340332
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Post by
sunwukung
Nope, I do not have NG. Nope, nobody misses a rejuv. Everyone gets their 1 second of attention (actually a little less).
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340332
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Post by
curlymon
@Sunwuking... ever heard of truncation? Yeah... your not at 1 second GCD yet because the difference in haste is small enough that the spell information just does not show anything past the 1 second point.
Is there going to be a game changing difference when you get that last 19 haste? No.
Are you at the 1 second GCD? No.
The math has be proven and checked and rechecked by many, many, many people around the world. 856 is the no CF GCD cap for resto druids...
@Les we always talk about 400 being the haste soft cap for boomkins. It is in fact 401 because making that extra .3 rating that forces us to round up is easily lost in reaction time of the player and swings in latency from client to server. Sure we can mitigate it as much as we can but 1 rating falls through a lot of cracks. Do you feel that 19 rating as a resto would not fall through similar cracks? The feel of the class in general won't change heavily if you are that far off and unless you are dead on the spell the second it comes of gcd every single time there is little point worrying about 19 rating, lol.
Not trying to enter the debate just looking at things from the outside in :P
Post by
sunwukung
Blizzards rounds down, well actually it shaves off the decimals of stat calculations at the hundreths place (0.00). They do this because an algorithm that also decided to round up/down would require a lot more processing power. Considering the number of times their computers are calculating our stats, I understand completely.
I am not sure the exact method in which Blizzard's math calculates the additive effect of multiple percent-based buffs on a person. These 2 possible scenarios some most probable.
Unhasted Nourish cast is 1.5sec = unhasted GCD is 1.5sec.
Hasted Nourish cast time = Hasted GCD.
My unbuffed nourish cast time is 1.09sec(ingame tooltip) with 837 haste(25.53%), and 5/5 GoTM, no CF.
#1:
1.09 - 8%(0.0872) = 1.0028(1.00)
or
1.09 - 8% (0.08) = 1.01
Now, if the "OR" math of this scenario was correct, when I receive 8% haste buffs, my tooltip would read 1.01 sec nourish cast time, but it reads 1.00sec. Therefore, using deduction, the shaving doesn't occur until the final value.
#2:
1.09 - 5%(0.0545) - 3%(0.031065) = 1.004435 (1.00)
or
1.09 - 5%(0.05) - 3% (0.03) = 1.01
Once again, the "OR" math fails the tooltip test.
Tooltips don't lie. Obviously, if I only have a moonkin and a ret in a 25man (only 6% haste), I wouldn't hit the 1sec cap, as if no shaman.
Edit: Blizzards math is real funny. 1.09 from 1.5 is about 27.3% haste
Post by
340332
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Post by
curlymon
@Les
The idea I meant to put across was not healing 1 less person as a result of not being capped. I meant that you can still heal those 15 people but you will have a very small time where the each person will not, in fact, have rejuv on them. You will still do the 5x1 rotation but it will be a bit slow is all.
Ideally you get over 856. I'm not saying we should ignore that. Far from it. Just saying that that last little bit is not going to make or break a resto's ability to heal. Just limit potential.
@Sun
Blizzards rounds down,
well actually it shaves off the decimals of stat calculations at the hundreths place (0.00).
They do this because an algorithm that also decided to round up/down would require a lot more processing power. Considering the number of times their computers are calculating our stats, I understand completely.
That would be
truncation
.
In mathematics and computer science, truncation is the term for limiting the number of digits right of the decimal point, by discarding the least significant ones.
For example, consider the real numbers
5.6341432543653654
32.438191288
−6.3444444444444
To truncate these numbers to 4 decimal digits, we only consider the 4 digits to the right of the decimal point.
The result would be:
5.6341
32.4381
−6.3444
Note that in some cases, truncating would yield the same result as rounding, but truncation does not round up or round down the digits; it merely cuts off at the specified digit. The truncation error can be twice the maximum error in rounding.
The part you are missing is that Blizz only truncates the display of cast time to 2 decimal places. The number itself is stored as a constant and only recalculated at a point when it changes (i.e. heroism, procs etc.) Since it is rarely, for all intents and purposes, recalculated the number is actually stored out much more accurately. So while the display on your nourish is in fact 1 second. The gcd and actuall cast time is not. In addition all the calculations for the display information for spells and abilities is offloaded onto the client system as they are not a critical calculation and a change in them clientside would cause no advantages to be gained server side.
As I mentioned to Les above this small amount of haste to be missing in the long run and we are talking about very small numbers. You may heal very, very well as you are currently setup, but without maxing out that last little bit you are in fact reducing your true potential. As a human we have very little ability to perceive that small of a time block but it still does exist. Computers see that time block and for them it is an eternity.
Post by
sunwukung
1 second nourish
Post by
SignupSucks
Sorry for the confusion, I'm a bit iffy with the terms, I was thinking the soft haste cap would be 735 (the haste needed with 3/3 CF) and the hard cap would've been 856.
You are confusing terms. Whether you have CF or not, they are both "soft caps" - the point at which the benefits for a stat are greatly, greatly reduced, but still exist. Because of its diminishing returns, there is no hard haste cap at all. No matter how much haste you have (you could have a million %haste), you'll never turn a cast spell instant - that is, able to cast while moving, versus the need to stop for a split second to cast - so there's always a cast time reduction being applied.
Contrast this with, for example, Armor Penetration, which has an actual hard cap: 100%. Obviously you can't reduce your opponent's armor below 0.
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340332
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404185
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Post by
curlymon
Actually the closest you can come to a resto "hard cap" would be reducing the 8 second cast of Tranquility to 1 second but that is nitpicking :P
By Ober's definition, which is technically completely correct, there is no such thing as a true hard cap for haste as the cast time would become infinitely smaller but never zero.
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404185
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